It is a sad day when I have to make an appt. with a chair of another dept. to discuss tenure issues because my own chair is completely useless.

WTF is up with that? I mean, seriously. You do your job or you get out -- kids or no. And being chair means being available. Its one thing to have a colleague who teaches and does little extra that requires hard scheduling because of the kiddies (not defending, just saying those people can potentially be doing their jobs -- at least bare minimum), but if you're chair it is a basic job responsibility to be there and have the damn meetings and stuff.

Grrrr. Am irritated for you.

I hate kids.

Yes, I said it. I hate kids. I mean, there are some individual children that I like (friends' babies and toddlers), but overall? I just have no use for kids.

I have no maternal instincts whatsoever, except towards animals. Similarly, Trapper dislikes children (even more so than I do) and has no paternal instincts except towards our kitties. No rugrats for us.

Needless to say, we (especially me) are always getting asked when we're having kids. I always tell people we don't want kids, which evokes shock and even sometimes near-ANGER from people who apparently have nothing better to do than worry about how I plan to use my uterus. They say things like, "HOW can you not want kids?" "Oh, you'll change your mind!" and "Just hold this baby - doesn't that make you want one of your own?" I've even been told that I will never be able to understand true love and the way the world works until I'm a mother.

I've started now, when people ask why I don't want kids, I ask them why they wanted kids. This baffles them and usually shuts them up long enough for me to make my escape.

And I totally agree about kids growing up with a sense of entitlement. Our society has become too damn child-centric.

OK, I didn't mean to hijack your comments section, but damn, this topic gets me going. LOL

profgrrrrl...thanks for the support. What can I say? He's turned out to be a nice enough guy but a shitty chair. And the worse part is I was on the search committee that hired him. Oh, the inhumanity of it all.

Whitters...don't worry, rant away! I find it so interesting that an increasing number of women (couples) feel the way about children that you (and we) do. And are opting for pets in lieu of kids. Your comments about the things people say to you really hit home, too (and I know it will with Dr.Karen, as well). I love your response to them. (It reminds me of when I got married and people would ask me "What does your husband think about you keeping your name?," as if I needed his permission. And I'd say "Well, we both decided that we'd each keep our own names," which always totally perplexed them.) I may borrow your comment. Or, I may just shut them down completely by telling them I'm sterile.

I'm Whitters on this one. I don't plan on having kids either and people look at me like I have a third eye when I say so. And I especially hate when they are so certain that one day I'll change my mind. No, I'm not some dumb 22 year old without a care in the world, I have no interest in having kids. Why is that so hard for some people to understand. I think it's neat that I'm finding out all this stuff we have in common. :)

My parents and in-laws always get pissed when I say that I probably won't have kids until I either have tenure, or am quite sure that I'm going to get it, or quite sure that I'm not (in which case I'm leaving academia because who needs to get another position after that?). Basically, this means not for another 5 years or so.

It's tough because New Yorkers are breeders, and increasingly, people of my cohort are having kids, which impacts my social life too. But I've seen others who have kids who act much like the profs you describe, and I'm just not interested in juggling the work-necessary-for-tenure and kids. Besides, aren't there like a million studies showing that women who have kids before tenure are MUCH less likely to get it? (And that men in the same position are MORE likely to get it?)

All's I gotta say is I'm so glad I'm one of those damn baby killin' liberals. :-D

Thanks for stealing my topic, Cheeky! ;-)

Ok.. now that we’re onto this, let me say a few more things….

God love ya, Whitters for being so blunt. Although I personally wouldn’t go that far (hey.. I’m from a big family… I cant hate ‘em), I DO hate the “Culture of Kids” that CheekyProf is talking about. The concessions that are made for people with kids (everything from parking spaces, to free airplane seats, to more flexible schedules), and more importantly, the EXPECTATIONS that PWKs (People With Kids) have about how they will be treated and perceptions of what is acceptable behavior.

Ahem..Attention please, PWKs. Here are a few basic rules:

1. It is NOT ok to bring your screaming, snotty, ill-behaved children to nice restaurants in the evening. This wine is expensive. I want to enjoy it.

2. It is NOT ok to sit in First Class with us on a TEN HOUR TRIP to Hawaii with your screaming infant and restless 2 year old. This actually happened to me this summer. Not kidding.

3. It is NOT ok to bring your children to cocktail parties. They are too young for cocktails or to hear the language that I am likely to use.

4.It is NOT ok to bring your children to parties and STOP WATCHING THEM or assume someone else is watching them. (How often have you been somewhere and found yourself chasing someone else’s kid so they didn’t fall down the steps/into a glass coffee table/off the deck/down a well/into a ravine?!)

5.It is NOT ok to begin every sentence with “Well, I have an infant, so….” Or “Well, I’m breastfeeding, so…”

6. We do NOT want to hear every last minute detail of your kid’s life. If we want more info, we’ll ask.

7.We DO expect you to be able to carry on conversations about topics not involving children after you give birth

8.We WILL make fun of you relentlessly if you lose the ability to do #7.

9.If your kid is hurting someone/screaming/running around/kicking things/throwing things/making a mess, STOP him/her. You do NOT want me to do this for you.

10.If we reprimand your child for hurting someone/screaming/running around/kicking things/throwing things/making a mess, THANK US.

I know y’all have more….. let’s hear them!

I hear you on the not having kids thing... we're just going to stick to cats, thanks very much (and thankfully my parents don't EVER pressure us about it. Actually, thankfully few people have pressured us! Guess I'm just an intimidating type...) I have a friend who, when asked when they're going to have kids, starts to sniff and whimper and says tragically, "I can't HAVE children," which always freaks people out like crazy. :-)

New Kid...I'd love to try that. :-) I may also start telling people we're having puppies instead, which will most likely confuse them enough to shut up. Reminds me of a bumper sticker we joked about getting our folks but decided not to. It read: Ask me about my Granddog LOL

Okay, COMPLETELY agree with Dr. Karen's list! The child-centered thing (where it means "let the preciousl ittle darlings do what they want and explore their personalities" rather than take responsibility for your kid's behavior) makes me want to puke.

(Except the first class to Hawaii thing....if you can afford to fly first class [or you have the miles or whatever] with kids, then you should be able to do it! First class doesn't guarantee quality of companions, just the big seats and free drinks and so on. Ideally you only travel with your kids when they're able to handle themselves responsibly...but sometimes that's just not possible. I mean, can you require airlines to make sure that the drunk annoying letches who insist on talking to you are booted out of first class for your trip to Hawaii?)

But I'm SO behind all the others on the list!

OK, I'll add to Dr.Karen's list...

11. Do NOT bring your baby or toddler to a movie, unless it's a matinee and unless it's something like Shrek. My social life sucks enough...when I finally get around to going out to a Sat. night showing of an R-rated flick, I want to HEAR the dialogue and NOT have to deal with you walking past the screen 20 times going in and out of the threatre as your kid cries/quiets. PLEASE get a sitter (or wait until it comes out on video).

12. Do NOT lock eyes with me, a complete stranger, in a public place while you are holding and bouncing your baby and smile at me knowingly as if to say, "Isn't she adorable?!..." I don't even know you; why do you expect everyone to love your kid?

13. Related to #12, do not make comments to me, a complete stranger, about your child such as "He's always fussy this time of day!," or "Ooooh, I think it's her naptime!," or "We just started on baby food!." Do you hear ME telling you random shit about MY life that you have no interest in, such as "I just got a revise and resubmit!," or "Damn, my gyno appt is this coming Friday!"??? NO!

14. I'm a feminist. I was a Women's Studies minor as an undergrad. I teach classes cross-listed with our Women's Studies dept. But I STILL do NOT want to see you breastfeeding in highly public places. Not next to me at the restaurant (see Dr.Karen's #1), not in the food court at the mall while I'm taking a break from XMas shopping, and NOT in the back of church during a wedding (yes, this really happened, although thankfully not mine).

15. Do NOT act like you’re better than/more important than me because you are with a child and I am not. This means you should NOT expect me to get off the elevator so you can fit your stroller on, let you ahead of me in line at the store, etc.

16. For the love of all things holy, PLEASE STOP sending me those fucking holiday cards with your kids on them. I used to love Christmas/Chanukah/Kwanzaa/New Year's cards. I used to love getting them and displaying them in my home. Not anymore. Now about 80% of those cards have kids on them that most of the time my husband and I do not know the names of and/or have never even met. Send those cards to RELATIVES, GODPARENTS, BABYSITTERS, and close friends ONLY.

17. Pay attention to where you are going with your gargantuan stroller. It’s a nuisance on wheels. This might come as a shock to you, but other people need to get through the aisle way, too. Yup, we’re the ones waiting behind you while you stand in the friggin’ middle of the aisle digging through your diaper bag.

I'm still in the zone where I think I may someday have a (1) kid [sorta appeals to me on the cool science experiment level]. Maybe. But I would probably drive myself crazy trying to make sure that I follow all of the above rules because I cannot stand it when others don't.

Plus ... well, I'm just not maternal in the regular maternal way. Hell, I'd be OK with adopting a 5-year old. Avoid the diapers and pukies altogether. Yeah.

Remember I said this. Shoot me if I ever act differently, OK?

18. Please, for the love of all waitresses and anybody that has ever waited tables in their life, if you feel that you MUST bring your child to a restaurant, DO NOT ASK FOR CRACKERS. Your child will no doubt proceed to make a mess out of said crackers and NOT EAT THEM, and there will then be a gigantic CRACKER MESS all over your table, under your table, around your table, and probably under and around the tables of the people that dined near you for the waitress/waiter/busperson to clean up, and knowing you and your cheap ass, you won't even leave a decent tip because you're too busy spending assloads of money on your baby's overpriced Gucci overalls and your triple venti, soy, half-caff raspberry no whip mochas from Starbucks.

And then you can kiss my white cracker ass.

19. Do NOT assume that I want to hear all about your baby's/toddler's bowel movements. Just because you think yellow, runny, stinky poop is the be-all, end-all of cuteness doesn't mean that I do.

20. STOP BLOCKING THE DAMN GROCERY AISLE AT TARGET WITH YOUR BIG-ASS TODDLER-LADEN CARTS!!!

21. Don't ask me if I think your child is adorable unless you want my honest opinion. And I can be blunt. Oh, yes, I can.

Remind me to never ask Whitters if this dress makes me look fat, m'kay?

"This dress exacerbates the genetic betrayal that is my legacy." -- Heather Moony

The last time I was hassled with the whole "you'll change your mind" nonsense about my not having kids, I chose the lesser of my obnoxious responses: I offerred to show her my scar! I didn't ask her if she ever changed her mind about wanting her (five!) kids.

Hell, kids annoy me and I'm a mother for god's sakes.

(Also a former I never wanted kids type)

;)

I have to agree with some of the things on the list.

Hee! mcbk, you can ask me ANYTHING. ;-)

And I'd like to amend my comment about the poop to say that it can be funny when bloggers talk about it. But when my coworkers coo over the contents of their babies' diapers like there's gold in there? HELL NO.